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BearlySane88
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In reply to concordtom • 8:33a, 1/29/26
concordtom said:
Zippergate said:
Tom, I don't think Pretti should have been shot. No one on the right celebrates Pretti's death. But Pretti was a violent man who repeatedly got into violent situations with the police. He purposely chose to carry a gun into that confrontation that day. It was an accident and accidents happen when you wrestle with cops while carrying a gun.

…..

I don't support the violence being perpetrated by either side in MN.




I liken what happened to Ms Good and Mr Pretti to what happened at the "Boston Massacre" March 5, 1770.

Fire! Fire? There was a building fire and people were being summoned to put out the fire at the same time that snowballs were being thrown at redcoats. So, who said Fire? Was it an order by an officer? An order to not Fire? A call for help by citizens?
The fog of situations.

Getting into street arguments with either side/person having a gun is risky. Things can happen!

As Bearister has typed many times, the J6 people are lucky they weren't mowed down with machine guns. (Sadly, that's probably what Trump wanted, to fuel his uprising.)

You won't catch me blocking cops in the street like that.
But braver people do stand up for others and injustices.

ICE agents need to practice restraint!
But Trump wants them to rough people up. And I am outraged by his horrible leadership!!!






I could find more examples of his promoting violence. He is a horrible person!


Braver or dumber?
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concordtom
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In reply to Zippergate • 8:34a, 1/29/26
Zippergate said:


As for Jan 6, we all saw the violence that day. Thousands were persecuted and prosecuted. I've read of many convictions for interrupting a government proceeding, trespassing etc, but I don't remember many (any?) where the charge was actual violence. I'm sure there were violent Trump supporters there, but it is my contention that most of the violence was perpetrated by Antifa, FBI informants, etc. We know these groups were there; it's on video. So my challenge to you is find me 10 convictions where someone, anyone, was charged with a violent act on Jan 6. Find me a few cases someone was charged with assaulting a LEO. It should be very easy given all the violence that day.



I think this is a joke.

I have seen hundreds of people being violent against cops on Jan 6.
It is wholly implausible this assertion you make that these were non-Trump supporters.

Whack.

Whacking cops. Pushing. Throwing things. Getting beyond their manned line. In the doorways. Smashing windows. Give me a break. You're out of your mind.
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concordtom
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In reply to movielover • 8:36a, 1/29/26
movielover said:
"Dialog" wasn't needed, neither were new powers or laws, just the will to enforce them.

Democrats used to also believe in deportations and border enforcement, something changed. Indications that Democrats strategy moved to flooding our nation with future Democrat voters. "Dreamers", family members, etc.

The ten million waiting in line legally? Forget them.


You can't enforce a barren desert.
You make ridiculous statements. Flooding the nation? What a joke of an absurd assertion. Not worth addressing you.
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concordtom
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In reply to BearlySane88 • 8:40a, 1/29/26
BearlySane88 said:

Braver or dumber?


I'll allow you to ponder your own question the next time you watch a war movie or a political movement film that props up heroism, or the next time you give your students a history lesson dealing with things like The American Revolution.

Nobody thought George Washington would be successful. Today he is a hero.

Most at the time concerned themselves with their farms.

You be the judge.
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movielover
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In reply to concordtom • 8:44a, 1/29/26
concordtom said:
movielover said:
"Dialog" wasn't needed, neither were new powers or laws, just the will to enforce them.

Democrats used to also believe in deportations and border enforcement, something changed. Indications that Democrats strategy moved to flooding our nation with future Democrat voters. "Dreamers", family members, etc.

The ten million waiting in line legally? Forget them.


You can't enforce a barren desert.
You make ridiculous statements. Flooding the nation? What a joke of an absurd assertion. Not worth addressing you.


Then how did President Trump stop the flow within three months?

Longer term, adding thousands of miles of Wall, access roads, and technology aids the effort. The Wall cuts down 90% of intrusions, redirecting flows and aiding BP.

When Biden became president, they immediately stopped construction and welded gates open!

Yes, a historic 10 - 22 million new illegal immigrants within four years counts as "flooding the nation".
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BearlySane88
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In reply to concordtom • 8:45a, 1/29/26
concordtom said:
BearlySane88 said:

Braver or dumber?


I'll allow you to ponder your own question the next time you watch a war movie or a political movement film that props up heroism, or the next time you give your students a history lesson dealing with things like The American Revolution.

Nobody thought George Washington would be successful. Today he is a hero.

Most at the time concerned themselves with their farms.

You be the judge.


Dumber if we are talking about interfering with federal law that has been used and enforced by both sides for years.
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Aunburdened
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In reply to concordtom • 8:45a, 1/29/26
concordtom said:
Zippergate said:
Big C said:
Zippergate, what exactly is your point?

We can all acknowledge that Alex Pretti wouldn't have gotten shot had he a) not been carrying a firearm... and/or... b) not put himself between the "officers" and another protester.

But are you validating his killing because of that?

Not validating it, calling it what it is: a regrettable incident that never would have happened if Pretti hadn't intentionally put himself in such a dangerous situation. Want to be a woke warrior and resist arrest? Fine, just be prepared to do the time and most importantly, don't put law enforcement officers, yourself, and others in danger by carrying your weapon. Isn't this pure common sense? I mean, it's so obvious that one has to wonder what Pretti's intent was given his state of mind. Personally, I think he intended to be a martyr because he knew how the Left and the MSM would treat his death.

Do I think the ICE agent should have fired? I don't know, probably not, but who am I to judge these things? Every law organization has procedures for handling these kinds of incidents. And we have courts. If the ICE agent acted unlawfully, he will be tried in court as is right and just. How soon we forget Saint Floyd. His killer, Chauvin, was tried, convicted and sentenced to a long prison term, much longer than a typical criminal serves for even worse crimes and was allowed to be mercilessly beaten in prison. (and I should add that Chauvin may not have even acted unlawfully but merely followed his training which would make him and his fellow officers not guilty.) This is our justice system. It's not perfect, but it's how we settle these kinds of things.

So what am I against here? I'm against the weaponization of this incident. I'm against calling the ICE agent a murderer. The guy is a human being who is doing a job and trying to get home to his family every night. Put yourself in his shoes for just a moment and ask yourself how you would react having to wrestle a deranged man with a gun on his body. But Pretti didn't use the gun, you say? Doesn't matter. Think about it. Another officer, following procedure, shouts, "Gun!", what's your first instinct? For most people, it is self-preservation. He has a right to defend himself. It's the law and rightfully so. And in the fog of war, unexpected things happen. Whether he and his fellow agents acted appropriately in this particular situation is for the judicial process to decide, but IT AIN'T MURDER. Do words have meaning anymore? Anyone calling this murder is fanning the flames of hate and encouraging more violence. Everything is being reduced to an ends-justify-the-means calculus. Is this really what we have become? Anything to stop Hitler?

I'm afraid that the radical Left looks at cases like Laken Riley and says, "See, the Right weaponizes tragedy so it's okay if we do the same." To that I say, good grief, think deeply about the details of these two cases. They are not the same. If you are outraged by what happened to Pretti and not by what happened to Riley (including all the conditions that were allowed to happen leading up to it), I don't know what to say; it shocks me that an intelligent, decent person could come to that conclusion.


How does Pretti's action compare to the actions of the J6 mob who physically whacked and attacked law enforcement?

I'm asking because so many claimed they were "peaceful protesters".



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concordtom
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In reply to movielover • 8:46a, 1/29/26
Whatever
As I said, I put you on ignore for a reason. Because there is no reasoning with you. So excuse me for not clicking on your next posts.
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BearlySane88
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In reply to concordtom • 8:47a, 1/29/26
concordtom said:
Zippergate said:


As for Jan 6, we all saw the violence that day. Thousands were persecuted and prosecuted. I've read of many convictions for interrupting a government proceeding, trespassing etc, but I don't remember many (any?) where the charge was actual violence. I'm sure there were violent Trump supporters there, but it is my contention that most of the violence was perpetrated by Antifa, FBI informants, etc. We know these groups were there; it's on video. So my challenge to you is find me 10 convictions where someone, anyone, was charged with a violent act on Jan 6. Find me a few cases someone was charged with assaulting a LEO. It should be very easy given all the violence that day.



I think this is a joke.

I have seen hundreds of people being violent against cops on Jan 6.
It is wholly implausible this assertion you make that these were non-Trump supporters.

Whack.

Whacking cops. Pushing. Throwing things. Getting beyond their manned line. In the doorways. Smashing windows. Give me a break. You're out of your mind.


He didn't say what you've seen, he said what convictions were there for violence.
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BearlySane88
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In reply to concordtom • 8:48a, 1/29/26
concordtom said:
Whatever
As I said, I put you on ignore for a reason. Because there is no reasoning with you. So excuse me for not clicking on your next posts.


To be fair, his points are valid
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movielover
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In reply to concordtom • 8:55a, 1/29/26
concordtom said:
Whatever
As I said, I put you on ignore for a reason. Because there is no reasoning with you. So excuse me for not clicking on your next posts.


I replied with about seven verified, simple facts you couldn't handle.

Hey, if someone argues we should have visas for 50,000 cobblers (a man in Martinez was setting up a training program), 200,000 construction workers, and 10,000 machinists (Germany?), I'm with them. Not just a reckless, unlimited invasion of low-skilled, illiterate newcomers. Dr. Barbara Jordan* was also against that.

* FTR, Black, Democrat, female, and lesbian.

Have a good day, brother.
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Aunburdened
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In reply to concordtom • 8:58a, 1/29/26
concordtom said:
Zippergate said:


As for Jan 6, we all saw the violence that day. Thousands were persecuted and prosecuted. I've read of many convictions for interrupting a government proceeding, trespassing etc, but I don't remember many (any?) where the charge was actual violence. I'm sure there were violent Trump supporters there, but it is my contention that most of the violence was perpetrated by Antifa, FBI informants, etc. We know these groups were there; it's on video. So my challenge to you is find me 10 convictions where someone, anyone, was charged with a violent act on Jan 6. Find me a few cases someone was charged with assaulting a LEO. It should be very easy given all the violence that day.


I think this is a joke.

I have seen hundreds of people being violent against cops on Jan 6.
It is wholly implausible this assertion you make that these were non-Trump supporters.

Whack.

Whacking cops. Pushing. Throwing things. Getting beyond their manned line. In the doorways. Smashing windows. Give me a break. You're out of your mind.

Evidence of a diseased mind is Democrats who are still talking about January 6 six years after it happened.

The United States already rejected your ****ty party that spent four years obsessing about January 6. Had you treated it like a normal riot, which is what it was, and not an insurrection, which it wasn't, arrested the people and sentenced the people who were actually violent and given misdemeanors to the folks who were trespassing non-violently, people wouldn't have rebelled against your ****ty party. But instead, your ****ty party overcharged non-violent trespassers and tried to play political games with it while simultaneously ignoring the very real economic pain that the voters elected them to solve. And your ****ty party got voted out of office as a collective "**** you" from the voters.

Every time I need a good laugh, I think about how badly a party would have to screw up to lose to a guy as unpopular as Trump and I feel much better almost immediately.
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concordtom
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9:10a, 1/29/26
Looks like we've established here once and for all, for all, that Ashli Babbitt was stupid.

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BearlySane88
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In reply to concordtom • 9:18a, 1/29/26
concordtom said:
Looks like we've established here once and for all, for all, that Ashli Babbitt was stupid.



So then we've also established that Good and Pretti were stupid too.
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concordtom
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9:25a, 1/29/26
Sure. I'll make that trade - after 5 years of ridiculousness by your compatriots.
No problem, gladly!!

Now Trump needs to grant honors to Good and Babbitt similarly, and pay $5M to each family for a wrongful killing, as he did for Babbitt.

I'll always hope Babbitt and ICE responsible, but if you want to make that trade, PAY.
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Aunburdened
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In reply to concordtom • 9:25a, 1/29/26
concordtom said:
Looks like we've established here once and for all, for all, that Ashli Babbitt was stupid.


I think you've done a terrific job establishing who is stupid.
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BearlySane88
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In reply to concordtom • 9:27a, 1/29/26
concordtom said:
Sure. I'll make that trade - after 5 years of ridiculousness by your compatriots.
No problem, gladly!!

Now Trump needs to grant honors to Good and Babbitt similarly, and pay $5M to each family for a wrongful killing, as he did for Babbitt.

I'll always hope Babbitt and ICE responsible, but if you want to make that trade, PAY.


Ask Wags, I don't have that kinda cash
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cal83dls79
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In reply to concordtom • 9:30a, 1/29/26
concordtom said:
Sure. I'll make that trade - after 5 years of ridiculousness by your compatriots.
No problem, gladly!!

Now Trump needs to grant honors to Good and Babbitt similarly, and pay $5M to each family for a wrongful killing, as he did for Babbitt.

I'll always hope Babbitt and ICE responsible, but if you want to make that trade, PAY.
how do I get in on this trade?
Priest of the Patty Hearst Shrine
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cal83dls79
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9:31a, 1/29/26
I'd first need to look at the fine print or have an attorney review ….
Priest of the Patty Hearst Shrine
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BearlySane88
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In reply to cal83dls79 • 9:31a, 1/29/26
cal83dls79 said:
concordtom said:
Sure. I'll make that trade - after 5 years of ridiculousness by your compatriots.
No problem, gladly!!

Now Trump needs to grant honors to Good and Babbitt similarly, and pay $5M to each family for a wrongful killing, as he did for Babbitt.

I'll always hope Babbitt and ICE responsible, but if you want to make that trade, PAY.
how do I get in on this trade?


Not that I'm pushing for you to do this but apparently get killed by federal officers
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cal83dls79
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In reply to BearlySane88 • 9:32a, 1/29/26
BearlySane88 said:
cal83dls79 said:
concordtom said:
Sure. I'll make that trade - after 5 years of ridiculousness by your compatriots.
No problem, gladly!!

Now Trump needs to grant honors to Good and Babbitt similarly, and pay $5M to each family for a wrongful killing, as he did for Babbitt.

I'll always hope Babbitt and ICE responsible, but if you want to make that trade, PAY.
how do I get in on this trade?


Not that I'm pushing for you to do this but apparently get killed by federal officers
like I said, the fine print
Priest of the Patty Hearst Shrine
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SBGold
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In reply to Aunburdened • 9:34a, 1/29/26
Yeah, I'll flag this
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oski003
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In reply to SBGold • 9:38a, 1/29/26
SBGold said:
Yeah, I'll flag this

Why?
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SBGold
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In reply to PAC-10-BEAR • 9:38a, 1/29/26
yeah we can flag this
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Aunburdened
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In reply to SBGold • 9:38a, 1/29/26
SBGold said:
Yeah, I'll flag this

I think I'll virtue signal by making a post every time I decide to flag a post.
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concordtom
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9:43a, 1/29/26
Press conference by Minnesota Ag stating how badly they rely on immigrant farm workers. They cannot get enough workers!! And US food production security needs these people.

Most all of this pro-border talk is simply xenophobic! That's my strong belief.

https://www.youtube.com/live/0A-YQlkhu24

Quote:
Senators Aric Putnam and Rob Kupec, Minnesota Farmers Union, and other state officials will host a press conference to discuss the impact that ICE activity is having on agriculture, farmers, and rural communities Jan 14, 2026


Border proponents NEED TO ADDRESS this side of the coin. Just like with their concerns for Dreamers, I have heard nothing.
Come to the table.
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SBGold
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In reply to Zippergate • 9:48a, 1/29/26
1. Should the borders be secure? Yeah, sure. I would be interested in a cost-benefit analysis of this though. There is a point where the cost exceeds the benefit. Immigrants actually do help our economy
2. Should non-citizen criminals be deported? Is there any crime that merits deportation? Certain levels of criminals should be deported yes. Or maybe jailed here. What if they are deported and free to go back to being a criminal with no consequences?
3. Should people here illegally be excluded from EBT, gov't housing, gov't healthcare etc? I don't think so no, maybe given less priority but it is not good economically or health-wise for them to be excluded
4. Should non-citizens be prevented from voting and if so, should reasonable measures be taken to ensure that this doesn't happen? Yes and yes. Red herring question though as MAGA election losers blame losses on this happening and it has never been proved to have happened EVER. Even after several investigations by MAGA admins.

I think you thought those were yes/no questions but they really are not.

UNITY OVER DIVISION

VOTE GAVIN

Go Bears Forever
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concordtom
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9:50a, 1/29/26
Republicans should listen to Amy.



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concordtom
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In reply to Aunburdened • 9:53a, 1/29/26
Aunburdened said:

Evidence of a diseased mind is Democrats who are still talking about January 6 six years after it happened.


It'll be talked about for the next 200 years.
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Aunburdened
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In reply to concordtom • 9:58a, 1/29/26
concordtom said:
Republicans should listen to Amy.


I don't have 15 minutes to waste on a woman who throws objects at her own staff. She's lucky there were no ICE agents present on the days she did that.
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movielover
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In reply to concordtom • 11:02a, 1/29/26
concordtom said:
Press conference by Minnesota Ag stating how badly they rely on immigrant farm workers. They cannot get enough workers!! And US food production security needs these people.

Most all of this pro-border talk is simply xenophobic! That's my strong belief.

https://www.youtube.com/live/0A-YQlkhu24

Quote:
Senators Aric Putnam and Rob Kupec, Minnesota Farmers Union, and other state officials will host a press conference to discuss the impact that ICE activity is having on agriculture, farmers, and rural communities Jan 14, 2026


Border proponents NEED TO ADDRESS this side of the coin. Just like with their concerns for Dreamers, I have heard nothing.
Come to the table.


We don't need 40 - 50 million to work ag and construction.

BTW, 10 million people are legally in line bc they have a Dream.
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movielover
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11:14a, 1/29/26
FTR, three folks here appear White.

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sycasey
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11:41a, 1/29/26
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sycasey
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11:55a, 1/29/26
Isn't "in theater" normally a term for an active war zone? They admit they're at war with Americans?

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DiabloWags
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11:58a, 1/29/26

Investigation Question #3:

Why did you continue to discharge your weapon at Alex Pretty at this point and time?

What made you decide that Mr. Pretti was still a threat as an unarmed man lying in the street?

"Cults don't end well. They really don't."
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