Aunburdened said:

---

tequila4kapp said:

---

Thank you for providing a list.

I am SO not interested in defending that list or getting into an argument. I am asking honest questions to understand how this isn't just TDS/anti-Republicanism, etc.

Here is my question: How do you level this list with the instances where the Biden Admin ignored/circumvented court orders (Title 9, student loans, CDC eviction moratorium, etc.)? The Democratic party rigging primaries to benefit one candidate (HRC) over another (Bernie)? The Democratic party booting a duly nominated candidate - who was also the sitting President - because they believed he could not win? (if they really thought he was incapable of doing the job they would have 25th Amendment-ed him). The Democratic party hand selecting a replacement candidate without any electoral process?

How are those actions any better or different? Were they not "King-like" in that centralized authority circumvented inconveniences to their ruling objective where those inconveniences were clearly rooted in democratic and rule of law principles?

---

The real problem is that the executive branch has had too much power ceded to them by the legislative branch.

---

I agree with that. But also the legislative branch has been busy killing its own legitimacy with gerrymandering and filibuster rules and so forth.

tequila4kapp said:

---

Thank you for providing a list.

I am SO not interested in defending that list or getting into an argument. I am asking honest questions to understand how this isn't just TDS/anti-Republicanism, etc.

Here is my question: How do you level this list with the instances where the Biden Admin ignored/circumvented court orders (Title 9, student loans, CDC eviction moratorium, etc.)? The Democratic party rigging primaries to benefit one candidate (HRC) over another (Bernie)? The Democratic party booting a duly nominated candidate - who was also the sitting President - because they believed he could not win? (if they really thought he was incapable of doing the job they would have 25th Amendment-ed him). The Democratic party hand selecting a replacement candidate without any electoral process?

How are those actions any better or different? Were they not "King-like" in that centralized authority circumvented inconveniences to their ruling objective where those inconveniences were clearly rooted in democratic and rule of law principles?

---

Wow. I'm initially a bit flabbergasted at your post because it seems that your attention goes immediately away from how outrageous the list is and instead focuses on who I perceive your opponent to be: "Democrats".

It's like if a kid gets caught doing something wrong instead of feeling shame for their transgressions (stealing cookies, kicking the nerd, graffiti) they proclaim that other kids were doing it and didn't get caught/in trouble.

I think we must first be noble, call a horse a horse.

So, to swallow my own medicine, I will therefore first address your turnabout or in-kind accusations:


How do you level this list with the instances where the Biden Admin ignored/circumvented court orders (Title 9, student loans, CDC eviction moratorium, etc.)?

I don't actually know what you are talking about.


The Democratic party rigging primaries to benefit one candidate (HRC) over another (Bernie)?

Rigging?
I would have to understand what rigging you are referring to. Is this the superdelegate issue? Yes, I recall something that didn't seem fair regarding superdelegates. But again, getting me up to speed takes time, is a rabbit hole. I'm willing to go there provided we agree that both sides look equally at all complaints. If kid A gets examined then kid B (the TDS list gets addressed, rather than be distracted away).

The Democratic party booting a duly nominated candidate - who was also the sitting President - because they believed he could not win? (if they really thought he was incapable of doing the job they would have 25th Amendment-ed him). The Democratic party hand selecting a replacement candidate without any electoral process?

Okay, I can speak to this issue. I would have preferred a full primary. But let me break it down into two time periods:

Period A, before his disastrous debate:
It's an interesting thing, which I've railed against, and which 240 years ago was cautioned against, how both parties end up eroding democracy, as power is controlled within the party structures and by the powerful people at the top who set the agenda at the parties.

This is witnessed by how all members of Congress vote along partisan lines, by how individual politicians choose not to run against a sitting president, etc.

So, the design of our electoral process is flawed, in a multitude of ways. To rip on "Democrats" because Biden initially went unopposed is a bit farcical, because it's simply common practice everywhere every time. Yes, it's wrong, I agree, but let's not think that suddenly "The Democrats" are dealing from the bottom of the deck as sneaky cheats.

Period B, after the disastrous debate:
What else would you have liked to see happen? I would think you'd approve that the Party did indeed do the right thing in terms of convincing Biden to step back from running.
Second, I think you should realize that for a very long portion of US history, the party nominees were not "elected" by voters but chosen by insiders. Do your research on that!
Third, yes, some newspaper op-eds and some political voices suggested a quick national vote with top 3-5 candidates. I would have preferred that. But it was scramble time, late in the clock, and it didn't happen. But don't lose your cookies - what if Biden had suddenly died, what did you want? What remedy do you propose??

I think what's happening here is that your student has literally killed people and you are ignoring that and saying cookies were stolen. It's truly outrageous, your redirection.


How are those actions any better or different? Were they not "King-like" in that centralized authority circumvented inconveniences to their ruling objective where those inconveniences were clearly rooted in democratic and rule of law principles?

Yes, both parties control power as kings, and they take turns.

I had a class in college (in DC) where we focused on the party structures. They control who/what gets on state ballots. Their candidates automatically get on every ballot. Third parties require signatures, and it's a pain.
Ranked choice voting is a good solution, but there are so many built in advantages, I can't even remember them all. The two parties have structured things to form a duopoly, and they pawn it off as "democracy".
If they truly wanted "democracy" they would open power sharing by more party groups.

And I must also say that there is a massive undemocratic thing about how money buys marketing buys votes buys candidates who therefore are beholden to the moneyed donors - this is why Citizens United is such a problem!



In summary, I would suggest that the problems YOU point to are primarily problems with the system, which impacts all players in both parties. I do not deny it and I'd like to change it.

But my outrage is that Trump is singularly psycho and must be stopped.

Perhaps you'll be able to confess your inner disgust of him. I do not particularly understand the hesitation to do so. I think it is rooted in base partisanship. Tribalism. It would be hard to root for a great athlete/guy if he wore a Stanford shirt. We evolved with Us/Them minds and they live inside us today.

Aunburdened said:

---

The real problem is that the executive branch has had too much power ceded to them by the legislative branch.

---

Well, yes, definitely!
But let's not lose sight of how radically unfit Trump is.
Both are big problems!!!

I see that I am late to this and prior to my response the usual suspects (sycasey, dajo, 88, Bearister) have said same things I did in trying to get you to open your mind to the looming atrocities happening and soon to happen.

I can almost guarantee that there will be some sort of retaliation for Trump. And I think the Americans who gave trump power (through voting and tacit support) will have themselves to blame.

Stop tacitly supporting him.
Join the next anti-Trump rally.
Speak out against him wherever you go.


Here's a warning for you to consider:

concordtom said:

---

tequila4kapp said:

---

---

How do you level this list with the instances where the Biden Admin ignored/circumvented court orders (Title 9, student loans, CDC eviction moratorium, etc.)?

I don't actually know what you are talking about.


The Democratic party rigging primaries to benefit one candidate (HRC) over another (Bernie)?

Rigging?

I would have to understand what rigging you are referring to.

---

What a good little Democrat you are

tequila4kapp said:

---

concordtom said:

---

Wow. I'm initially a bit flabbergasted at your post because it seems that your attention goes immediately away from how outrageous the list is and instead focuses on who I perceive your opponent to be: "Democrats"

---

This is incorrect. I am an independent, not an R. I cannot imagine a day where I would join either party. That is a purposeful choice. Some Ds are equally despicable to me as some Rs.

With like 2-3 notable exceptions this OT board is overwhelmingly filled with left of center people. There is a dynamic at play where 95% of the content here is from that perspective and - IMO - highly myopically so. Virtually any response to it becomes presumptive evidence for most here that the poster must be a Trump sycophant. To wit - some of you went straight past the line where I said I didn't want to defend the list of things Trump supposedly did and right to the assumption that I must be defending Trump. That's not a me problem.

I was attempting to point out the idiocy of this No Kings business by showing that the left does exactly the same stuff, if not worse. But - of course - this was folly…the lefties here cannot see it. Oh well, I tried.

---

Again, wow.
I specifically addressed your complaints about democrats.

You know, I think we can agree that Hitler was WAY far right of center. Yet you'd like to place discussion somewhere in the middle????
That middle would be horribly skewed.
It's the same assertion Elon posted, yet the opposite.


The thing that lefties are so incredibly blinded by, to use your imagery, is how some folks cannot see how radically unacceptable Trump is.

Maybe when Berlin is razed they'll change their opinion. For us, we see it!!

Aunburdened said:

---

concordtom said:

---

tequila4kapp said:

---

---

How do you level this list with the instances where the Biden Admin ignored/circumvented court orders (Title 9, student loans, CDC eviction moratorium, etc.)?

I don't actually know what you are talking about.


The Democratic party rigging primaries to benefit one candidate (HRC) over another (Bernie)?

Rigging?

I would have to understand what rigging you are referring to.

---

What a good little Democrat you are

---

This is a zero additive post.
You added zero factual information.
It's a negative.

Try again explaining your problem with the democrat primary process in 2016.

tequila4kapp said:

---

I was attempting to point out the idiocy of this No Kings business by showing that the left does exactly the same stuff, if not worse. But - of course - this was folly…the lefties here cannot see it. Oh well, I tried.

---

Maybe that's because it's mostly not worse?

"But - of course - this was folly…the lefties here cannot see it. Oh well, I tried."

BI Leftie = Anyone that buys exactly zero of the bullsh@it Trump has been slinging his entire life.

*Yogi would have you believe that I am a poorly closeted Republican. It makes me giggle like a school girl that you think me a Leftie. You are a Moderator with a firm Right bias that you "cannot see."

The simple objective truth of the matter is that Trump and his Administration lackeys are an absolute disgrace and embarrassment to our nation. They are also dangerous.

Put a spin on this to make it less disgusting:

https://bearinsider.com/forums/6/topics/133993

"People claimed Obama and Biden were dangerous too, that's what happens in a politicized world."

Agreed. But that is just a claim. If they want to pool evidence to establish it as a fact they would find that their claim was little more than a misguided false equivalency.

tequila4kapp said:

---

With like 2-3 notable exceptions

---

movielover
bearlysane
Oski003
Hawaiibear
Wifeisafurd
Cal88
Yogi (don't be fooled)
Tequila4kapp
Sfcitybear
Ludwigsfountain
Beargoggles
Minotstatebeav
Zippergate

Am i missing anyone?

dajo9 said:

---

tequila4kapp said:

---

With like 2-3 notable exceptions

---

movielover
bearlysane
Oski003
Hawaiibear
Wifeisafurd
Cal88
Yogi (don't be fooled)
Tequila4kapp
Sfcitybear
Ludwigsfountain
Beargoggles

Am i missing anyone?

---

LOL at how butthurt you've been since you were dead wrong on November 5, 2024

BearlySane88 said:

---

dajo9 said:

---

BearlySane88 said:

---

bearister said:

---

"People claimed Obama and Biden were dangerous too, that's what happens in a politicized world."

Agreed. But that is just a claim. If they want to pool evidence to establish it as a fact they would find that their claim was little more than a misguided false equivalency.

---

Except Biden allowing the insane amount of border crossing was absolutely dangerous. So was Obama drone striking the hell out of regions of the world

---

In 4 years Trump did more drone strikes than Obama in 8

---

How many US citizens did Trump drone strike?

---

Are you backtracking from your original claim?

BearlySane88 said:

---

dajo9 said:

---

BearlySane88 said:

---

dajo9 said:

---

BearlySane88 said:

---

bearister said:

---

"People claimed Obama and Biden were dangerous too, that's what happens in a politicized world."

Agreed. But that is just a claim. If they want to pool evidence to establish it as a fact they would find that their claim was little more than a misguided false equivalency.

---

Except Biden allowing the insane amount of border crossing was absolutely dangerous. So was Obama drone striking the hell out of regions of the world

---

In 4 years Trump did more drone strikes than Obama in 8

---

How many US citizens did Trump drone strike?

---

Are you backtracking from your original claim?

---

Huh? Stick with the program here. Bearister said that if i listed things Obama and Biden did that it wouldn't be actually bad. Then you brought up Trump, I understand you can't think about anything but him but that wasn't the topic at hand.

---

So, when Obama drones it is bad but when Trump drones it is good

BearlySane88 said:

---

dajo9 said:

---

BearlySane88 said:

---

dajo9 said:

---

BearlySane88 said:

---

dajo9 said:

---

BearlySane88 said:

---

bearister said:

---

"People claimed Obama and Biden were dangerous too, that's what happens in a politicized world."

Agreed. But that is just a claim. If they want to pool evidence to establish it as a fact they would find that their claim was little more than a misguided false equivalency.

---

Except Biden allowing the insane amount of border crossing was absolutely dangerous. So was Obama drone striking the hell out of regions of the world

---

In 4 years Trump did more drone strikes than Obama in 8

---

How many US citizens did Trump drone strike?

---

Are you backtracking from your original claim?

---

Huh? Stick with the program here. Bearister said that if i listed things Obama and Biden did that it wouldn't be actually bad. Then you brought up Trump, I understand you can't think about anything but him but that wasn't the topic at hand.

---

So, when Obama drones it is bad but when Trump drones it is good

---

Yeah maybe go back and read the thread. I never said that. For the last time, Bearister said I couldn't make a list of dangerous things Obama and Biden did. It had nothing to do with Trump. You're hyper fixating on Trump again and your TDS is showing

---

You said half of it. That it was bad when Obama droned. But Trump droned more and you have never complained about that.

BearlySane88 said:

---

dajo9 said:

---

BearlySane88 said:

---

dajo9 said:

---

BearlySane88 said:

---

dajo9 said:

---

BearlySane88 said:

---

dajo9 said:

---

BearlySane88 said:

---

bearister said:

---

"People claimed Obama and Biden were dangerous too, that's what happens in a politicized world."

Agreed. But that is just a claim. If they want to pool evidence to establish it as a fact they would find that their claim was little more than a misguided false equivalency.

---

Except Biden allowing the insane amount of border crossing was absolutely dangerous. So was Obama drone striking the hell out of regions of the world

---

In 4 years Trump did more drone strikes than Obama in 8

---

How many US citizens did Trump drone strike?

---

Are you backtracking from your original claim?

---

Huh? Stick with the program here. Bearister said that if i listed things Obama and Biden did that it wouldn't be actually bad. Then you brought up Trump, I understand you can't think about anything but him but that wasn't the topic at hand.

---

So, when Obama drones it is bad but when Trump drones it is good

---

Yeah maybe go back and read the thread. I never said that. For the last time, Bearister said I couldn't make a list of dangerous things Obama and Biden did. It had nothing to do with Trump. You're hyper fixating on Trump again and your TDS is showing

---

You said half of it. That it was bad when Obama droned. But Trump droned more and you have never complained about that.

---

Dude are you really not following? I'm sorry, you're on your own. I've walked you through this twice already

---

Trump droned more than Obama and attacked more countries than Obama. Facts you will run from.

tequila4kapp said:

---

concordtom said:

---

Wow. I'm initially a bit flabbergasted at your post because it seems that your attention goes immediately away from how outrageous the list is and instead focuses on who I perceive your opponent to be: "Democrats"

---

This is incorrect. I am an independent, not an R. I cannot imagine a day where I would join either party. That is a purposeful choice. Some Ds are equally despicable to me as some Rs.

With like 2-3 notable exceptions this OT board is overwhelmingly filled with left of center people. There is a dynamic at play where 95% of the content here is from that perspective and - IMO - highly myopically so. Virtually any response to it becomes presumptive evidence for most here that the poster must be a Trump sycophant. To wit - some of you went straight past the line where I said I didn't want to defend the list of things Trump supposedly did and right to the assumption that I must be defending Trump. That's not a me problem.

I was attempting to point out the idiocy of this No Kings business by showing that the left does exactly the same stuff, if not worse. But - of course - this was folly…the lefties here cannot see it. Oh well, I tried.

---

Actually there is only one person here I would consider leftist , Cbass1. Most of whom you call leftists are Democrats, e.g. moderate Republicans

BearlySane88 said:

---

dajo9 said:

---

BearlySane88 said:

---

dajo9 said:

---

BearlySane88 said:

---

dajo9 said:

---

BearlySane88 said:

---

dajo9 said:

---

BearlySane88 said:

---

dajo9 said:

---

BearlySane88 said:

---

bearister said:

---

"People claimed Obama and Biden were dangerous too, that's what happens in a politicized world."

Agreed. But that is just a claim. If they want to pool evidence to establish it as a fact they would find that their claim was little more than a misguided false equivalency.

---

Except Biden allowing the insane amount of border crossing was absolutely dangerous. So was Obama drone striking the hell out of regions of the world

---

In 4 years Trump did more drone strikes than Obama in 8

---

How many US citizens did Trump drone strike?

---

Are you backtracking from your original claim?

---

Huh? Stick with the program here. Bearister said that if i listed things Obama and Biden did that it wouldn't be actually bad. Then you brought up Trump, I understand you can't think about anything but him but that wasn't the topic at hand.

---

So, when Obama drones it is bad but when Trump drones it is good

---

Yeah maybe go back and read the thread. I never said that. For the last time, Bearister said I couldn't make a list of dangerous things Obama and Biden did. It had nothing to do with Trump. You're hyper fixating on Trump again and your TDS is showing

---

You said half of it. That it was bad when Obama droned. But Trump droned more and you have never complained about that.

---

Dude are you really not following? I'm sorry, you're on your own. I've walked you through this twice already

---

Trump droned more than Obama and attacked more countries than Obama. Facts you will run from.

---

Did I ever deny that? You're arguing with yourself buddy

---

You never acknowledged it. You never addressed it.